What do you want from a MMORPG overall?

[BigJonno]

I've noticed that there seems to be three main types of MMORPG players that can be divided by what they want out of the game.

1. A game. These people just like playing it as they would any other game. They often see it as some kind of competition and will try anything to level up faster or get better equipment. They NEVER roleplay and most problem players fit into this category.

2. An adventure. These people aren't as obsessed with levelling as "game" types, but they consider it an important means to an end. They want to go out and have fun, either by themselves or with their friends and in most MMORPGs higher level=more fun. The quest is more important than what's at the end. They will sometimes roleplay.

3. A world. These types want to escape into another world. They often like doing non-adventuring things. They will sometimes act like "adventure" types, if they are playing a heroic character. They will almost always roleplay.


Anyone want to add to/comment on/change these? Which one are you?

[Babo83]

I'm a number 2.
For me a great MMORPG has to be a game where you can just go hunting alone as well as in group, have a little fun every once and a while, have lot's of quests and land to explore... Also, i really like to see some game secrets like a fake wall in a quest, secret emotes, etc.
I think that now with all these good MMORPG's coming out "soon" people will watch at new things that they haven't see before in a previous game, and make there choice of game based on that (and of course the reviews, beta feedback, ... ) .
But that's just what i think about it :)

[Finn MacCool]

which number are the guys liking to be the cause of big changes while being part of a group as big as possible?

[JonnyG]

I actually like all 3.

Sometimes I feel like exploring, sometimes I want to group and quest, sometimes I want to solo and quest.

Sometimes I feel like a nut. *Sorry, reference to an old candy commercial.*

Then there are times when I just want to get on and mash and bash.

JonnyG

[Benedikt]

usually i am nr.2, sometimes nr.1, almost never nr.3 - and often i use online game as a chat :)
ben

[Loki]

Hmmm...I think I'm a 2 and a 3. Mostly, a type 2, but in the absense of friends to group with or just tired of leveling for experience, I'm the kind that'll go out and look around. "Stop to smell the roses", in a manner of speaking. I like looking for the bizarre, out-of-the-way places in a game. Easter eggs, if you will, because you never know what lies inside that little hut sitting in the middle of nowhere or whats in that torn book lying on the floor.

[esion]

I am number 1, and I feel I am not a "problem player", and I don't feel bad saying that I am a number 1!

I am just one of those people that likes to get a game and beat it, don't lolly gag around and enjoy it, but get to the end asap then enjoy it. I like hanging out with people that are motivated to get to the end and if that means powergaming count me in.

I feel some times powergamers get a bad rap as "leet" and uncaring people, but its a game, I play to beat or get as high as possible and play the end game. [This is one large reason why I left SWG already, there was no end game, I got 3 master professions in two weeks]

I never roleplay because it requires more work than I get satisfaction from it. Its a game!, there is no reason for me to be in character, I am who I am. Don't come talk to me in some broken language, barbaric tone, unknown context, etc. because you THINK you are the dwarf, orc, wizard, etc. that you are PLAYING! I have been in many groups in MMORPGs where the roleplayer gets made fun of because the fact is there are very few roleplayers.

Do you think this makes me a bad person or "problem player" because I want to play a game and not get involved in the context of the game? I think not, but that is my view, you are welcome to yours.

[JonnyG]

I don't think its that you're a bad player. I think its that people are worried that the devs will cater to the hardcore gamer only, or vice versa.

It's a fine line the devs have to walk to ensure the game is playable by all types, not just one or another.

JonnyG

[Jotun]

I think there's room for all kinds of players. I won't dictate to other people how they should play as long as they (through their actions/behavior) don't interfere with my own play experience.

[esion]

This might sound dumb but I will say it anyway...the devs should cater to the hardcore players...and this is why....

Hardcore players are the ones who play the game the most, who put the most time into a game, consider it a job and work to get to the top the fastest (i.e. the end game). If you make the game so that it takes a hardcore gamer a year or more to get to the end, that means a non-hardcore (casual) player will take two years or more to get to the end.

In principle this is why EQ did so well, EQ took a VERY LONG time to lvl and grind to get to the top, but once to the top people wanted to play more to show that they had made it and play a character they had been developing and working on for a year or more. Being the highest level in EQ is a feat and people admire those individuals, its part of respect. Dragon raids, epic quests, etc. were great fun once you had developed a really high level character, and starting a new char was insane.

Take SWG, they tried to walk the fine line of hardcore vs casual, and it ended up being way too easy. You can master a profession in that game in a month playing only 3 hours a day. Like I said earlier I mastered artisan, marksman and architect in two weeks. It is too easy, and now people are leaving because they are done with the game and don't have anything to do. [Granted it is early and a lot of content is still missing from the game, including most of the end game stuff]

Take DAOC as another example, it took me about 8 months of casual game play to get to level 50 (when it first came out), once there I played a lot because of PVP and the fun it entailed. But now you can get to 50 in a month if you powerlevel, and being level 50 is nothing special, it is merely a prerequisite to being able to PVP unless you wanted to get owned in RVR. This makes being high level not as important and there is no respect for getting to level 50.

The point im trying to get to is that the longer it takes to get to the end game the better the game. It leads to people being more interested and hooked on the game, which leads to more money and subscribers. Hardcore gamers are not bad, they are good, they are dedicated to being the best and they take pride in it. I don't think that catering to hardcore gamers would be bad because it will make the game a stance of honor be high level and people will strive to get to that level.

[JonnyG]

IMO, I think you're wrong about catering to hardcore gamers. The devs will cater to where the money is. There are a lot less hardcore players. What they have to do is design to the different types and make it fun for everyone.

JonnyG

[esion]

Maybe I missed the point of my last post...it was kinda long winded.

Yes they will cater to where the money is. I feel that if they can make a game that takes a long time to conquer then they will get more money in the end. I have NEVER heard of people quiting a MMORPG because it was taking too long to get to the end game, I have only heard of people quiting a MMORPG because they were at the end game and felt it got boring and repeatative.

Hence you make a game long and hard you will get subscribers for a long time because people dont like to leave things unfinished (Hence EQ still has a lot of subscribers and die hard fans).

[Jotun]

Originally posted by esion
I feel that if they can make a game that takes a long time to conquer then they will get more money in the end.

I think that provided the "getting there" is fun, that you're right. I'm not sure that the hardcore players will care enough to play another grindstone game when they have plenty to pick from already, and it dissuades the more casual player, which I think the game will appeal to.

Imagine if it takes a long time to get there, but it's fun.

[esion]

I very much agree Jotun. I think all game developers want to make a game that is fun and appeals to everyone. I just hope that it takes awhile to develop a character and play the game so that people don't get bored and run off to another game after a month.

The key is to make it grinding enough that people don't get mad but at the same time making the grind fun to do.

[Benedikt]

maybe it would not be bad (if some player are near last level to add new classes, available to only those who reach higheest level - they should not be more powerful, just someth new to play.
ben

[esion]

That is thinking outside the box...I like it! But I still think that grinding and working hard for those levels makes it a priviledge to get those new classes.

[BigJonno]

Esion, why do you even play MMORPGs? I'm not critiscising your style of play, I just don't understand it.

[esion]

I play mmorpgs because i like building characters, building a name for myself as a good player, and be recognized as one. I love playing with other people in real time, building relationships with people around the nation, playing in guilds, etc.

Why? Because I am a hardcore gamer and don't roleplay it means I cant enjoy the genre?

[BigJonno]

No, I'm not saying that. It's just that I've never personally been able to understand why people who aren't interested in roleplaying are attracted to MMORPGs. You seem intelligent enough to have a reasonable discussion about it, so I thought I'd ask.

I'd probably understand it better if MMORPGs were more fun to play in themselves. Let's face it, most MMORPG combat isn't exactly fun and exciting, especially when you have to grind.

[esion]

Yes it is true that grinding xp from boring turn based combat is not the most fun or productive thing I have done in my life, but I don't think I get the thrill from just that. I get the thrill from getting together as a group and working as a team to kill something much greater than each of us. I enjoy the use of classes and knowing how to be a certain "tool" in a battle (i.e. tank, caster, healer, etc.)

Maybe our definitions of roleplaying are different. To me roleplaying is acting as the character you have created in game. So an orc coming up to me and speaking in broken english, or a wizard using some theatrical speech, or the best yet...people using made up languages that they have made up and use because they are playing a certain race. I remember that my first guild in EQ was like that, about 5 years ago I was new to the game and joined a guild, then they told me to go to thier website and learn the language, I watched the guild chat and thought my god what am I doing?...needless to say I quit the guild that night.

I like being who I am in game, a nice guy who plays a lot, who can help with any problems one might have, or help get something someone can't get by themselves. To me playing an mmorpg is just another game with friends and making friends as you play, that is what I love about it.

By the way I am normally a pure fighting tank, but I have been known to play a rogue at times.

[BigJonno]

They made up their own language? That's a bit over the top, even for me. I don't have any problem with people who don't roleplay in RPGs, even when I play pen 'n' paper RPGs. Personally I enjoy roleplaying, but I've got a talent for acting, so I find it easy (well, relatively. I played a live-action Vampire: The Masquerade for a while and was playing a Russian character. Keeping a Russian accent up for 4-5 hours straight isn't easy.)

The one thing about non-roleplaying players in MMORPGs that does annoy me is that most of them have no consideration for those of us that do. It is hard to get immeresed in a game when KILLERD00D666 comes running past shouting "any1 want ph4t l3wt!!!!!"

[Eloi]

Originally posted by esion
I like being who I am in game, a nice guy who plays a lot, who can help with any problems one might have, or help get something someone can't get by themselves. To me playing an mmorpg is just another game with friends and making friends as you play, that is what I love about it.

Going back to the original post, I suppose I fit into category 2. Some of the best adventures I ever had in AC1 were a result of being approached by a lower level character who got stomped and needed help. Even when I got stomped and had to get more help, I still enjoyed it. Some of my best in-game friends were made through these random encounters. That's what make the MMORPG fun for me, exploring the world, dealing with challenges, and both helping friends (and strangers) when asked and counting on their help in return.

For me, the reputation of my character is not just for the pure gratification -- to quote Sally Field "They like me, they *really* like me!". It is also just fun to meet new people, not to mention an important survival strategy.

[Benedikt]

esion: hehe your last 2 post looks to me like it was me who wrote it :) :)
ben

[Jotun]

I see where you're coming from Esion....I like referring to other characters by their avatar names rather than real names ("Hey bob, circle 'round to the left") kind of wrecks the mood. But in this context, I don't know that I'd worry about a whole lot more than that. I'm looking forward to group interactions and complex tactics. I think the need to work together may lend itself to some light RP tho, such as having a character who insists on taking the lead or one who sits back and lets others make decisions, etc.

[esion]

The one thing about non-roleplaying players in MMORPGs that does annoy me is that most of them have no consideration for those of us that do. It is hard to get immeresed in a game when KILLERD00D666 comes running past shouting "any1 want ph4t l3wt!!!!!"

That is just inevitable though, there are just some people out there that like to play for drops and like to sell the drops to make money or themselves look good. I won't deny that I haven't done that though, because it comes with the territory of playing a lot.

I think the reason I don't roleplay comes down to the fact that I don't have the commitment to stay in character for hours on end (because I play for 10 hours+), like you said earlier its tough work. And sadly even when I did play paper and pen RPGs I didnt get in character, to me its about exploring, developing a character and getting together with friends to play a game. I guess I'm the weirdo.

[BigJonno]

Esion, the example I used was a bit extreme. You don't have to do anything vastly different to what you do to roleplay well. A lot of people (myself included) get the most enjoyment out of playing a character that is basically themselves, adjusted to fit into the gameworld. It wouldn't take much for most non-roleplayers to give their characters names that in with the game and not talk in abbreviations and 1337 speak all the time. I know text-based communication is a chore sometimes, but a little effort would make things better for a lot of people.

[esion]

It wouldn't take much for most non-roleplayers to give their characters names that in with the game and not talk in abbreviations and 1337 speak all the time.

Oh I agree with you there...I hate when people name their characters something dumb like "Demon666" or "bunnyboy" or something stupicd. This can be fixed with a simple spell checking code before the character is accepted on the server. I always name my characters something in the genre...hence why my signature has my two most commonly used ingame names.

But just because someone names their character something roleplayish doesn't mean they have to roleplay in game. Like I said before roleplay to me is to "act" and pretend to be my character. As for the talking in leet and abbreviations, I think that the abbreviations like WTB, LFG, WTS, LVL50, STR, DEX, etc come with the game, you can't get rid of those. And leet speak is just something nerdy people hold on to and think they are cool with, kinda like my earlier example of a made up language. It took me a year to understand all the leet speak jargon...

[manicman]

I like you esion. Besides myself you remind me of my daily group tank, he was good people too.

[esion]

Sweet I have a fan...I thought I was going to be hated for my hardcore ways....:)

[Benedikt]

Originally posted by esion
Sweet I have a fan...I thought I was going to be hated for my hardcore ways....:)

hey, i am your fan too! :)
ben

[esion]

I am feeling the love at mythicahq!!!....over at mythicarealms.com Soulsbane mocked my avatar QQ.

Thanks guys.

[Mi Tes]

Hey, I love the dancing dog you have there!

[esion]

Hehe thanks...:) I have no idea what it is from, I just found it.

[Mythica Realms]

Esion, think you took soulsbane's comments the wrong way, he was just being "playful". Your lil d00d rocks.

See ya at the Realms Esion!

[esion]

HEHEHEHE ... I was just messing, I don't take offense at anything :) I am very sarcastic.

[Wannabe God]

I want adventure and challenge out of a game. It must be fun too. And not so challenging that its frustrating. Asking a lot am I. Yes I am, and I'm worth it.

[Azgorath]

Rampant PvPing and PKing. I'm not much for chatting or crafting.

[esion]

Originally posted by Azgorath
Rampant PvPing and PKing. I'm not much for chatting or crafting.

Mythica may not be the best place for you :) They have said Mythica will be PvE oriented with some PvP...so if you want rampant I say SB is your best right as of now...But dont leave us yet, maybe they will change it.

[Ohgop]

I'd call myself a type 2.

I, personally, don't like rampant PKing, I think it detracts hugely from the game when a group of level 50s are just running around massacring your party of mid-20s. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy my PVP, but without consequences for murder, lets keep it on an even ground (or at least an open ground).:wave:

[Azgorath]

You cannot have PvP in a level-based game. It's too unbalanced to make it worthwhile. Only in a skill-based game would you be able to have a balanced system of doing it. That's where it's fun at.